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Hospital Security Radio System
http://interceptradio.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=20&t=8602		 Page 1 of 4
Author:  code3kid [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 8:08 am ]
Post subject:  Hospital Security Radio System
Hello all,

I work in healthcare security in Washington state. My employer has recently tasked me with implementing a working radio system with 4-5 user radios for our main hospital campus by the end of the fiscal year. Here's the downside. Administration only budgeted $5,000 for the system. Our current radios are the Motorola DTR650 (1 watt, digital 8/900 MHz simplex ISM frequency hopping) coverage is very marginal with them and all our guys hate them and leave them in the office. We recently domonatrated 2 Motorola XPR6550 (mototrbo, 4 watt, simplex) they didn't work muck better than the DTR650. My employers have began discussing demonstrating the icom IP100H voice over IP radios, used in conjunction with a single IP1000C controller that supposedly will work off of the hospitals existing wifi. The downside to that system is that it won't work in the parking lots or in elevators. My idea is that we could buy 4-5 used/refurbished Motorola XTS2500 VHF with AES encryption from a reputable dealer I know and operate P25 simplex with AES encryption. That way I could have an emergency button, UID alias, P25 paging, and scan local LE, Fire, and EMS. Though I'm not sure how well VHF P25 will work in the hospital. I have a Motorola XTS5000 that I would like to test with another VHF P25 portable in the buildings and parking lots but I don't have another one. I'm hoping that my connections at the local sheriff's office will let me borrow one of thier XTS2500 cache radios for testing. If we do go with VHF or UHF we will operate on either GMRS or MURS. I doubt we can get a repeater + subsriber units for less than 5k. If we went with the XTS2500's I'd prefer AES encryption but I may consider ADP software encryption. I don't have a KVL.

Any input, ideas, questions, comments at all?
Author:  Atomic Taco [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 10:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
code3kid wrote:
...that supposedly will work off of the hospitals existing wifi. The downside to that system is that it won't work in the parking lots or in elevators.
Or during a power failure; a time when you'd want it the most.

code3kid wrote:
That way I could have an emergency button...
I haven't seen CPS for the XTS so I can't say for sure, but without a console I think the options for the emer button may be limited to transmitting tones (MDC, DTMF, etc). And in simplex mode you're dependent on others being within range to be able to hear those tones.

code3kid wrote:
Though I'm not sure how well VHF P25 will work in the hospital.
My guess would be similar to what you saw with the XPRs. But that's just a guess.

code3kid wrote:
I doubt we can get a repeater + subsriber units for less than 5k.
You get what you pay for. If you're able to get five XTS portables for $5,000 but they don't significantly improve your coverage that's $5,000 down the drain.
Author:  Wilrobnson [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 10:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
Atomic Taco wrote:
code3kid wrote:
...that supposedly will work off of the hospitals existing wifi. The downside to that system is that it won't work in the parking lots or in elevators.
Or during a power failure; a time when you'd want it the most.

The vast majority of hospitals have their wifi/networking stuff on a double/triple/more redundant power system...Generator, UPS, etc. Reason is there is a lot of stuff using that wifi beyond staff member's personal cell phones...IV pumps, cardiac telemetry, capnography, communications, etc.
Author:  N7QOR [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 11:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
Wilrobnson wrote:
Atomic Taco wrote:
code3kid wrote:
...that supposedly will work off of the hospitals existing wifi. The downside to that system is that it won't work in the parking lots or in elevators.
Or during a power failure; a time when you'd want it the most.

The vast majority of hospitals have their wifi/networking stuff on a double/triple/more redundant power system...Generator, UPS, etc. Reason is there is a lot of stuff using that wifi beyond staff member's personal cell phones...IV pumps, cardiac telemetry, capnography, communications, etc.


Regardless, using wifi for "mission critical" types comma is less than intelligent
Author:  Wilrobnson [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 12:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
N7QOR wrote:
Regardless, using wifi for "mission critical" types comms is less than intelligent

And yet, they all do it, from the IP Cisco phones everyone carries to the little Icom IP radios to the lanyard IP intercom radios ER staffers love to wear. I've seen a new one recently, the IP emergency call buttons in patient rooms (mounted next to the Bluetooth TV remote control).

This isn't 2005 when script kiddie Taco could bring down the Multicare IV-Pump WLAN with his Dell laptop.
Author:  N7QOR [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 1:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
I don't know what hospitals you refer to when you say "they all do", but here in PNW I have worked in nearly all of the largest facilities here and I can tell you they do not.

Not to mention, doing something wrong / unwise many times does not make it right / wise
Author:  Wilrobnson [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 2:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
I've seen this stuff in Swedish, the Hutch, Providence, Children's, TG, MB and even tiny Skagit Valley.

I can't recall what St Joe's was using.

ETA- links

http://www.wi-fi.org/beacon/natalie-she ... nnectivity

http://www.wi-fi.org/discover-wi-fi/healthcare
Author:  Jim [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 4:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
Does the hospital you are working at have any type of radio system that they use for maintenance & housekeeping?

GMRS is not for commercial use anymore unless grandfathered if that.

MURS would probably not be good for your purpose.

No encryption is allowed on GMRS or MURS so if you require encryption they are out anyway.

Have you looked into renting from a local commercial radio shop?

They might be worth checking into.

At least you might find out from them what would work for your needs.
Author:  N7QOR [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 5:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
Swedish uses Motortrbo for wide area, and Vocera for on campus. Vocera does use a wifi network that is segregated from the general network

UWMC uses a 900 MHz Spectralink. Very similar to what Fred Meyer uses except it is the original infrastructure which was 900 MHz based. The newer Spectralink uses 2.4.

I think a lot of the "correct answer" here relates to which specific types of communications we are speaking of.

Obviously in smaller places comma are typically shared across a single platform, whereas in the larger facilities one will see a difference between "clinical" communications vs. "operational".
Author:  N7QOR [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 5:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
Of course after writing the above I take note of the title of this thread and see we are taking specifically of "Security" (my bad)

To that end I know that Swedish use Trbo across the Seattle area, sites are linked via their network but it's Trbo

UWMC "Security" is actually UWPD, on 800mhz, Fransiscan uses 450mhz FM for now ...

I believe Virgina Mason was on UHF last time I was there, but that's been a couple years

Out on the coast Grays Harbor was on UHf

Those are just some of the facilities I've worked in .....
Author:  Wilrobnson [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 5:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
LOL, and all that time I was talking about med devices, not hospital security.

This is why I should've texted you this afternoon.
Author:  Jim [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 6:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
N7QOR wrote:
Swedish uses Motortrbo for wide area, and Vocera for on campus. Vocera does use a wifi network that is segregated from the general network

UWMC uses a 900 MHz Spectralink. Very similar to what Fred Meyer uses except it is the original infrastructure which was 900 MHz based. The newer Spectralink uses 2.4.

I think a lot of the "correct answer" here relates to which specific types of communications we are speaking of.

Obviously in smaller places comma are typically shared across a single platform, whereas in the larger facilities one will see a difference between "clinical" communications vs. "operational".


Spectralink on 2.4G is digital spread spectrum isn't it ?

I work at 3 Fred Meyer each week and never have been able to catch them with a Scout 40 counter.

Sorry if I'm getting OT. ;)
Author:  Wilrobnson [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
Jim wrote:
Sorry if I'm getting OT. ;)

Any more off topic comments will be deleted and the poster will be issued an infraction*

We gonna stay on topic, or do I gotta go to your house and shove your dog's head down the toilet?

* The mods here suck. Who are the mods?
Author:  nickcarr [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
https://www.amazon.com/Motorola-RDU4100 ... B000Y357Y2
Author:  N7QOR [ Sun Sep 18, 2016 9:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Hospital Security Radio System
Wilrobnson wrote:
Jim wrote:
Sorry if I'm getting OT. ;)

Any more off topic comments will be deleted and the poster will be issued an infraction*

We gonna stay on topic, or do I gotta go to your house and shove your dog's head down the toilet?

* The mods here suck. Who are the mods?



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